I really want to love Clojure. I've been playing with it recently and I still have some hopes for it. I am comparing it to Elixir for my next language of love. I have a lot of experience with Javascript/Node and secondly Ruby.

I want to embrace a functional paradigm. I want to lean on Clojure because of the versatility of also being able to leverage ClojureScript.

So far I have hit some bumps that are a bit frustrating.

1. I changed too many files at once and the stack trace error I got gave me literally 0 clue on what was wrong. It was such a feeling of doom that it scared me on how to debug Clojure apps. The stack trace was full of Java errors and nothing pointing me in the direction of where the app was failing from Clojure's perspective.

2. Momentum of Web-Development and embracing new technology. I really believe in GraphQL and there isn't much support or conversations with using GraphQL with Clojure and ClojureScript.

3. I want to code Lisp better, but I'm not sure how to learn all the tricks on using Paredit. I use Spacemacs in Vim mode and a lot of the tutorials I see are of course in Emacs bindings so getting the know-how of navigating s-expressions in Spacemacs evil mode is quite the challenge but I'm going for it.

4. Boot up time is lame but it is what it is. `lein run` then `lein cljsbuild auto` can take ~20-30 seconds on a relatively fresh project on my MBA. After the initial boot time it's fine though.

Overall I have my head up high but those are some of the things I'm struggling with. I really want to love Clojure/lisp. I worry most about the community not being large enough to share examples of how to do new things. Which of course can be argued for the better (not a trendy community) but it instills worry nonetheless, especially when one really wants to adopt a tech all around (like GraphQL). I have an argument in my head that shouts "Well, if there's so much momentum in Javascript/Node for that ecosystem then might as well use that. Or even Elixir with Absinthe" – in the end it's about productivity right? :) Anyway rambling at this point.

yogthos

I think some of your frustrations might stem from your workflow. You really have to use the REPL to get the most out of Clojure development.

For example, you should never change a bunch of code in different files and then try to run it and hope it works. Clojure workflow would be to change a particular function, send it to the REPL, see that it does what you want, then change the next function, and so on.

ClojureScript equivalents to GraphQL would be Om Next http://hueypetersen.com/posts/2016/02/13/om-next-from-a-rela... and and Posh with Reagent https://github.com/mpdairy/posh It's the same concept expressed in a Clojure idiomatic way.

I would highly recommend using Vim fireplace, Cursive, or Atom to start learning Clojure. Emacs is a very complex editor that takes a lot of time investment to be productive in. There's no reason to try and learn it while also learning Clojure. I've been developing Clojure professionally for the past 6 years and I've never used Emacs for that.

dfischer

Also more to your point on REPL - do you know of community docs of how to use the repl more effectively? I got the basics down but really want to see how a wizard does it.

Jach

I think if you only want to see how wizards do it, you'll have to fully master emacs. As a non-wizard and vim-forever guy, who only occasionally writes Clojure for hobby projects, here's my advice.

For a long time I got by with creating a split-screen terminal with 'screen', and then used vim-slime (https://technotales.wordpress.com/2007/10/03/like-slime-for-...). It doesn't have to be split, I just like it that way, but the idea is you have essentially two views talking to the same screen session. In one you launch a repl (with lein, or even a ruby/python repl if you want) and on the other half you open vim and type things like ctrl+c etc. to send fragments from vim to the repl.

More recently I've been using slimv (https://kovisoft.bitbucket.io/tutorial.html and https://github.com/kovisoft/slimv -- and if you want my three vimrc prefs http://pastebin.com/VjwrEJJQ) after using it for Lisp, which uses swank, and found I could also do some of this for Clojure's repl (https://github.com/technomancy/swank-clojure). Unfortunately it's kind of outdated, that's not where the community is going (and I haven't really bothered to figure out exactly where that is, though that project's readme gives hints, nor have I really tried Fireplace recently enough to say if I still dislike it). But it works for me, for now, unless I want to use ClojureScript. I'd say give it a shot, you might like it.